Doing away with pro stock?
- Thread starter Jeff Childs
- Start date
That's exactly what I was eluding to in my earlier post.
Motec has a ton of "bells and whistles" in their system, and my gut says too many for NHRA to police. I'd agree with Jeremy that it's likely going to be Holley, Fast or BS3.
429 K/AA Old Dude
Jeremy, Jeremy I've been around fuel injection for 15 years now and have a little experience with several brands and after using a Motec you'll drop kick most other brands out of your shop. NHRA can have a 9 year old kid download the Motec after a run and it will tell you everything that was turned on and used during that run so policing would not be a problem. What do you have against Australians anyway, you like China better????
Jeremy, Jeremy I've been around fuel injection for 15 years now and have a little experience with several brands and after using a Motec you'll drop kick most other brands out of your shop. NHRA can have a 9 year old kid download the Motec after a run and it will tell you everything that was turned on and used during that run so policing would not be a problem. What do you have against Australians anyway, you like China better????
Me too, for 21 years......haha. I've never owned a carbureted car
There are so many options available now that are awesome. However, the fact that the NHRA decided to implement 30 year old throttle body fuel injection technology there is no need for much more than an injector controller. Lol
Won't it just go to the highest bidder anyways??
If you use an injector controller couldn't you still use the msd box for spark? Might be easier for NHRA to check for traction control
Aaron, most of the EFI systems are capable of running the ignition side of the engine too. We are converting our B/A over to EFI right now and will completely do away with the MSD. It will have separate coils for each cyl and WAY hotter spark as a result.
NHRA said the box they choose will do both the fuel and ign I think. Also, form what I understand it will be a throttle body setup with the injectors in the ports... Not a old fashioned "TBI" setup.
NHRA said the box they choose will do both the fuel and ign I think. Also, form what I understand it will be a throttle body setup with the injectors in the ports... Not a old fashioned "TBI" setup.
Yes you could.
On another note. With the motec, you can set different levels of access. So NHRA could easily have locked out features in the ECU for the build. Last I heard, Drake Devore from motec was trying to get the M1 ecu approved. This was last year.
Most support from motec comes from motec east in n.c.
So, got a question for the EFI gurus. What type of manifold/throttle body system is better? Option A or Option B. Stock and Super stock cars seem to have option B.
A:
B:
A:
B:
429 K/AA Old Dude
Jeremy, Jeremy:
Model A's had a distributor, cap and wires. You still suggesting that??? No distributor, no MSD box, no two miles of wires, one cam pickup one crank pick up, 8 denso coils with a 3" plug wire. When your not racing you can use the coils for a welding machine.
Jeremy, Jeremy:
Model A's had a distributor, cap and wires. You still suggesting that??? No distributor, no MSD box, no two miles of wires, one cam pickup one crank pick up, 8 denso coils with a 3" plug wire. When your not racing you can use the coils for a welding machine.
Since its pro stock wouldn't you want the best product available?
Shane T. uses MoTeC on all the stuff hes been doing overseas and look what they have accomplished. 5.97 with a turbo 6 cylinder doorcar is pretty damn bad ass.
Shane T. uses MoTeC on all the stuff hes been doing overseas and look what they have accomplished. 5.97 with a turbo 6 cylinder doorcar is pretty damn bad ass.
Option B is a boosted EFI manifold. They could run the manifold upside down if they wanted. The fuel will get there no matter what with 50 psi helping it along. You see manifolds like that in Stock and SS because that is how the stock manifold/throttle body is configured, so they have to leave them that way.
The only reason the manifolds are so short from the OEM is hood clearance. Every NA EFI setup I've been around (stock-ish) the first thing we do is put a taller intake manifold on it to make more power.
I don't like the no hood scoop rule. It's a race car. Race cars need hood scoops. When I see a Pro Mod with a blower or a hood scoop sticking up I think "race car"! When I see a flat-hooded turbo Pro Mod, I think "that thing looks goofy...." No offense to the turbo guys. Turbo stuff is wicked fast. It just doesn't "look" like a race car. And even though they are trying to broaden the mass appeal of the cars, I don't think doing away with the scoops will help that. I also don't see how you can make more power with a non-tunnel ram manifold, regardless of what's on top of it
The only reason the manifolds are so short from the OEM is hood clearance. Every NA EFI setup I've been around (stock-ish) the first thing we do is put a taller intake manifold on it to make more power.
I don't like the no hood scoop rule. It's a race car. Race cars need hood scoops. When I see a Pro Mod with a blower or a hood scoop sticking up I think "race car"! When I see a flat-hooded turbo Pro Mod, I think "that thing looks goofy...." No offense to the turbo guys. Turbo stuff is wicked fast. It just doesn't "look" like a race car. And even though they are trying to broaden the mass appeal of the cars, I don't think doing away with the scoops will help that. I also don't see how you can make more power with a non-tunnel ram manifold, regardless of what's on top of it
I hesitated to jump in the ring.......15 years ago the EFI sytems were brutal....except Motec . We tested every system available , when we found out that F1 was running Motec , we went with it . They were helpful , knowledgeable , and it flat worked , ( with the right manifold or without a plenum style manifold ) 2015 technology is here and they are all good , John Meany was the leader of the pack and he helped us back then also . EFI is a beautiful thing , in every way , you can put the gas where you want it , no more wet flow trip , air flow improves , you can program the amount and when in the RPM scale , it's all good .
Motec will always be our choice , they were there for us when we almost gave up , but the corporate $ will be who gets it , put them all in the fight would be too good to be true and it would make little or no difference which system you used . Sure would be good for the aftermarket in drag racing , but I guarantee you this , It is definitely not going to save anyone any money , no , on the contrary , get your wallet out , it's worth it but the experimenting cost lots.....we built 5 or 6 different manifolds , throttle bodies etc.
Motec will always be our choice , they were there for us when we almost gave up , but the corporate $ will be who gets it , put them all in the fight would be too good to be true and it would make little or no difference which system you used . Sure would be good for the aftermarket in drag racing , but I guarantee you this , It is definitely not going to save anyone any money , no , on the contrary , get your wallet out , it's worth it but the experimenting cost lots.....we built 5 or 6 different manifolds , throttle bodies etc.
Thanks for the laugh!! ALL of NHRA's decisions are based on money.... Not what is right or wrong.
If NHRA really wanted to do the right thing they would list four or five controllers and let the TEAMS VOTE on what one they want to run...
If cost containment is a high priority, the EFI controller should be open to all suppliers and be a off the shelf item with a P/N that anyone can buy.
If it is off the shelf, to keep in check, NHRA just go order replacement unit from Summit/Jegs and plug it in, then team loads their tuneup and should be good to go. No BETA models that only special people get.
Will the Tech savvy teams have an advantage, yes, but would be interesting who would step up with biggest contingency.
I also See K&N approved/mandated air box and filter. Big aftermarket seller for K&N
Back to promotion, Monster Energy Sponsors Supercross, but other energy drinks are allowed to sponsor riders.
If it is off the shelf, to keep in check, NHRA just go order replacement unit from Summit/Jegs and plug it in, then team loads their tuneup and should be good to go. No BETA models that only special people get.
Will the Tech savvy teams have an advantage, yes, but would be interesting who would step up with biggest contingency.
I also See K&N approved/mandated air box and filter. Big aftermarket seller for K&N
Back to promotion, Monster Energy Sponsors Supercross, but other energy drinks are allowed to sponsor riders.
Jumping In
I have not jumped in here but here it goes...
They have fixed nothing. the 10,500 limit was about the best thing they could have done to make it more affordable for the small teams, the problem is that almost everything else they have done slow negates the 10,500 rule. Small teams are screwed with this deal I feel bad for them...
As for FI NHRA has no policing ability whatsoever, so whatever they go with needs to be simple so they can "try" to police it somehow. Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if this ends up like Indy Car racing where the teams get the pop off valve from the Sanctioning Body right before they race. The only difference would be it is the ECU now...
All the teams have it right $$$ get more payout and cars will come. There is ZERO reason right now for companies to get involved with PS, until they fix that they won't fix ANYTHING else... At the end of the day if you in in PS you might get a total of 6 minutes of TV time on a Sunday possibly at midnight after softball playoffs.. NASCAR give companies 3-5 hours 43 weekends a year.
If you were a motorsports company where would your advertising $$ go?
I have not jumped in here but here it goes...
They have fixed nothing. the 10,500 limit was about the best thing they could have done to make it more affordable for the small teams, the problem is that almost everything else they have done slow negates the 10,500 rule. Small teams are screwed with this deal I feel bad for them...
As for FI NHRA has no policing ability whatsoever, so whatever they go with needs to be simple so they can "try" to police it somehow. Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if this ends up like Indy Car racing where the teams get the pop off valve from the Sanctioning Body right before they race. The only difference would be it is the ECU now...
All the teams have it right $$$ get more payout and cars will come. There is ZERO reason right now for companies to get involved with PS, until they fix that they won't fix ANYTHING else... At the end of the day if you in in PS you might get a total of 6 minutes of TV time on a Sunday possibly at midnight after softball playoffs.. NASCAR give companies 3-5 hours 43 weekends a year.
If you were a motorsports company where would your advertising $$ go?
I agree with Nhra that something has to be done to increase spectator interest in prostock, more spectators equals more corporate interest and yes it is about money, sorry but that's the way the world works. However instead of adding more rules (rules always cost more money) I would have liked to see them "guide" the direction the class evolves towards, perhaps something like leaving the 500" engines as they are but allowing small block (400"?) overhead cam, direct injection engines and let the chips fall where they may.
JMO,
Mike Mckeigue
JMO,
Mike Mckeigue
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