Allowing splay heads in E/SM and E/SMA just obsoleted everyone’s SB2 heads . Why do this? Change not only heads but. ,valve train , camshafts, intakes all because of the change They wonder why Comp looses competitors. Who’s great idea was this? Bert Dawson. Comp Super Stock. 3185.
Head rule changes
- Thread starter bert dawson
- Start date
They should never have allowed SB2 heads in E anyway. Should have left E as true wedge heads with a single carb. But for some reason they decided to allow the SB2 and let it destroy the wedge combinations. Now, some genius wants them to allow splayed valve heads in E and I am sure it was pointed out that SB2 was already in E so NHRA allowed it.
Anyone wanting to run something other than a wedge had plenty of options in Comp. So why even request the change from the beginning? Aren’t there like 60 comp classes now? When I asked why they made these rule changes, I got the answer of people where trying to survive so they opened up the rules. BS answer if you ask me!
Anyone wanting to run something other than a wedge had plenty of options in Comp. So why even request the change from the beginning? Aren’t there like 60 comp classes now? When I asked why they made these rule changes, I got the answer of people where trying to survive so they opened up the rules. BS answer if you ask me!
YOWIE-WOWIE!!.. people are trying to survive, so they opened up the rules??.. great deflection in that answer, Michael.. maybe, JUST MAYBE, NHRA should look at everyone that is trying to survive in their selected classes.. then they need to abolish the rule that says "Good For Me, But Not For Thee", and stop pampering a chosen few that has the need to limit their competition.. YES FOLKS, I just said that..
Does NHRA take the cost factor into consideration when making such rules changes??.. NOW, to stay competitive in E/SM or E/SMA, one will have to build a new motor, instead of improving on what they already have.. we all know that you just don't unbolt a wedge head, and bolt on a splayed valve head, without adding to the cost.. Bert Dawson is not wrong in his assessment.. does NHRA take the cost factor into account when arbitrarily banning certain parts, and shelving racers??..
NOW!!.. someone told Michael that NHRA has opened up the rules to help "SOMEONE" survive??.. I wouldn't see a problem if they opened up the rules to help "EVERYONE" to survive.. but apparently, an E/SM or E/SMA personality may have needed that "Good For Me, But Not For Thee" rule to be applied.. PERSONALITIES, PERSONALITIES, PERSONALITIES!!!.. sorry guys, but I need to run 50 lbs light in my class to survive.. it's OK with you, RIGHT???
There is no reason to doubt what Michael Compton states was conveyed to him, and hopefully, opening the rules "To Help Someone To Survive" sets a new precedent in Comp.. NOW, I guess we all can just notify NHRA that we are requesting a rules change to guarantee survival.. another NEW twist of lemon, if you will.. OOOOOOOORRR, are they going to now say that ALTERED actually means ALTERED??
I wonder if Collins, NHRA TECH Officials, and NHRA Rules Committee members were required to take the HYPOCRITIC OATH OF OFFICE??.. yes, Ass Clowns, I'm pointing directly at you.. IMAGINE THAT!!!
Did some digging on this subject. Here is the wording in 2019 & 2020 rule book on cylinder heads for Super Mod -
CYLINDER HEADS - Hemi, canted/splayed valve, or wedge head permitted in A through C and I. Classes D, F, G, and H restricted to true wedge cylinder heads (with inline and parallel valves) only.
As can be seen, E is not referenced at all; completely left out. Now, the 2021 rules to 2022 amendments reads for cylinder heads in Super Mod -
CYLINDER HEADS - Hemi, canted/splayed valve, or wedge head permitted in A through C, E, and I. Classes D, F, G, and H restricted to true wedge cylinder heads (with inline and parallel valves) only.
I assume they meant E was SB2, splayed valve or wedge all along?
CYLINDER HEADS - Hemi, canted/splayed valve, or wedge head permitted in A through C and I. Classes D, F, G, and H restricted to true wedge cylinder heads (with inline and parallel valves) only.
As can be seen, E is not referenced at all; completely left out. Now, the 2021 rules to 2022 amendments reads for cylinder heads in Super Mod -
CYLINDER HEADS - Hemi, canted/splayed valve, or wedge head permitted in A through C, E, and I. Classes D, F, G, and H restricted to true wedge cylinder heads (with inline and parallel valves) only.
I assume they meant E was SB2, splayed valve or wedge all along?
It's is strange that most people that I've talked to, all believe that E is a wedge head class.. BUT, I guess if it's not specifically mentioned anywhere, they can stick it where they want.. so now, E comes after C, not after D.. must be the new math thing.. looks like Christmas came early for E/SM and E/SMA folks.. who are they??
Kinda brings me back to the original billet head issue, and the NHRA notes on survival.. trying to keep in my that "ALTERED" actually does mean "ALTERED", why are they not accepted in all "ALTERED" classes??
If racers are to survive, and competitive parts are not readily available, NHRA should take note of that and make proper amendments to assist in a racers survival.. it seems that they have turned a blind eye to the I, K and L classes.. but right in the middle is J, with billet heads allowed.. how did that work??..
We're talking ALTERED, not ECONO ALTERED.. there is supposed to be a difference.. why are they accepted in V6 Dragster, and V6 Dragster Automatic classes, but not in ALTERED, where history states things are ALTERED??
Kinda brings me back to the original billet head issue, and the NHRA notes on survival.. trying to keep in my that "ALTERED" actually does mean "ALTERED", why are they not accepted in all "ALTERED" classes??
If racers are to survive, and competitive parts are not readily available, NHRA should take note of that and make proper amendments to assist in a racers survival.. it seems that they have turned a blind eye to the I, K and L classes.. but right in the middle is J, with billet heads allowed.. how did that work??..
We're talking ALTERED, not ECONO ALTERED.. there is supposed to be a difference.. why are they accepted in V6 Dragster, and V6 Dragster Automatic classes, but not in ALTERED, where history states things are ALTERED??
Michael not that many guys run “E” pretty easy to figure out who “needs” the help. Complete bulls..t
I was actually pleasantly surprised to see that A/ND an B/ND are now allowed to use aluminum heads, while adding .015 to their respective weights.. the cast heads that they had to use have always been ridiculous, and of course, they need to "survive"..
Maybe the .015 idea should have been applied to other classes.. JUST SAYIN'..
Maybe the .015 idea should have been applied to other classes.. JUST SAYIN'..
My 2010 rule book states that E/SM can have a canted/splayed valve head. What’s the problem here?
Hi Craig,
That is helpful, but some don't have the 2010 version.. I recall E being a true wedge class, and couldn't find E even included in the 2020 or 2021 versions.. then I found it stuck in between C and D.. and now E has been apparently amended to included splayed valve and SB2 heads.. but I will re-read..
The problem is, as I see it, is that some folks have put together a true wedge combination for E/SM or E/SMA, as that is what the rule specified.. and their combination could be new, or recently built.. NOW, with those classes basically becoming any head goes classes, their combinations are probably not as competitive as planned.. there are remedies, but they tend to be expensive..
Do these folks now scrap the top half of their motors, and start fresh??.. does everyone have the financial ability, or even the time, to do that??.. or do they now leave Comp in search of a Super Stock class??.. these could be problems for some..
Charlie
Under classes in the super modified category, E/SM 9.50-10.49 lbs per inch. What else does it say?
I find that NHRA has removed the 2020-2021 Rule Book from the site, and now only list 2021-2022 Amendments.. I'll have to go the "The Library", and get back to you on your question..
2011 Rule book reads E/SM 9.5 t 10.49 pounds per cubic inch. Wedge or Canted-valve cylinder heads, maximum 366 cubic inches.V-8 only , 2800.00 pound min.
Thanks Clint and Brian My 2020 rule book as well as 2009 say the exact same thing as Clint’s post. That’s at least the last 12 years only canted and wedge have been legal. Makes me wonder if anyone has been running splay heads all this time in the confusion? Bert
Thanks for the clarifications.. I guess that my confusion kicked in while reading the "Cylinder Head" section, that led me to believe that E is a true wedge class, and that other heads have now been added.. the weight break section didn't seem to match the cylinder head section in what I could find on the NHRA site.. then it was gone..
The investigation continues.. WHO DAT??
The investigation continues.. WHO DAT??
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The head rule was changed years ago because of the fords. We run E with a wedge and an sb2 and the wedge is faster.
You are correct Casey. I was told the same about the reason for E being "open' on head design. Thus the reason my buddy Ashton runs E and cannot run D is because of the rule for true wedge head only in D. Makes sense now that I was able to back track the rule books and speak to several people in the know.
Yes and I'm not sure about what Ford has but I don't know if Ford even has a true wedge head comparable to the Chevy's. I remember somewhere in that time frame of allowing sb2 heads in E super that they started allowing sb2's in A/EA and B/EA and they were previously wedge only.
Yes, the SB2 head deal came out some time ago and caused some confusion. But was the SB2 head legal but splayed valve head not in some classes? Now you can use a splayed valve in E. So I guess is a SB2 different or the same as Splayed valve? And isn't ford heads now a billet head?
Sorry for the dumb questions.
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