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Terry Spargo A/AP Record

Brandon based on the drc and 1320go incrementals didn't you only have to go .46 under to win that race. When I was shooting that round and saw you caught him and then lifted so early, I was shocked that he was able to drive around you.

Your car makes so much power based on the numbers I read, and I was told you were heavy across the scales. When you have at least .2-.3 in the bank above the .5 magic number, why not take a bit of a hit, just so you don't have to lift so early at future races. Preserve the index so you have .65 or .7, but when is the right decision to win a race in the class. Again this is all based on the numbers I read and the weight you are over.

My assumptions are you can go .85 under in the right conditions. Use a bit, so you don't have to lift so early next time.
Just my thoughts.
Please if you reply don't be mad at me, I am not spending the money (but things like this in Comp frustrate me a bunch, and I am pretty knowledgable about most drag racing aspects and strategy), just try and explain the rational.

The idea in any class is to win. Even in Comp. You are an awesome driver ,cut really good lights as well.

How much does a guy like Rampy have in the bank, he usually takes the stripe

Dean Murdoch, Speedzone Magazine
 
Dean,he can go around .70 under in good air at legal weight. .85 under would be a 7.08 I think..Not gonna happen with a 341..lol.. He only had the weight in during elims. If he takes a hit now in the good air come middle of summer he will only be .55 under.... It was just a div race and he also would of had to race Lane next round and Lane was clean on hits so Brandon for sure would of had to take a hit.... Just not worth it in the long run.

He is pretty much doing what you suggest Dean,he has a .65 to .70 under car in most conditions and he is preserving his index to keep it that way.... You have to remember loosing even .01 at the level he is at could cost him thousands or even tens of thousands of dollars to get back. Win a div race and win what, $1500 if your lucky? Burn a few hund in index that will cost way more to get back then you win? Again,just not worth it.
 
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i ACTUALLY THOUGHT HE COULD GO .8 UNDER MARK, based on the run Sunday in elims with 1000 feet of better air than when he ran the 7.239

Whatever the numbers are, it is tough seeing a guy loose to save yourself down the road.

How many C/A guys can run .7 under in good air, if not too many or none then go out and win.

How much cash and contingencies for a national win in Comp. Is it over 5k.

Dean
 
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First of all , Dean , nice to have your interest in Comp , represented by one of the best drag-race magazine online systems , out there, Speedzonemagazine.com . Comp has evolved into this predicament that you are questioning , Brandon is fast as hell , WHY NOT WIN ? cause it's not worth it....period. If you can get some luck at a div. race , you use what it takes to win without taking the risk of a perm. hit , if you look at Rampy or Fletcher or Ficco for that matter , they take the same attitude at a National event. Us less achieving Comp racer's would probably throw caution to the wind to win a National (I know we did) but it means you got to go back to the dyno to make it up. Comp is the best class in sportsman racing , it's also the most difficult and the most expensive , probably the best message that could be sent , we need to find COMP Sponsor's , for Comp , THEN the scope of why we do do what we do will make more sense,
 
Dean, I actually shut off at 5.6 into the run, so you can't go off the 1000' numbers. I went 4.68 to half track on that run. If you look at qualifying I went a 7.265 with a half track of 4.652. That means I was probably going to run a 30 which is 2 perm. I never went past Adam, I just got to his back tire when I realized I would not make it without running it out and also knew I would be to fast. Maybe you forgot I lost 5 hun. against Pat which was my dumb mistake, I couldn't see him. I was pitted next to Adam and we compared note's afterwards. He would have went 60 under if he didn't shut off when he saw me shut off. I was down 4 more than him but had 5 on the tree, so it would have been around a 2 hund. stripe which I could tell wasn't enough room to back in. The thing is... 1st if my main goal was to win Mission I would have been shutting off in qualifying and qualifying a little lower. I love running my car and trying new things and learning more. 2nd.... I am not the only C/A car in the country. I am freinds with some of these guys, not all... but some:D, I feel in good condition's I should try to be resposible, its not all about me and its not good for the class to ruin C/A. Its second round at a point meet, who cares! I went a 23 at 188 in 1800 foot of air, I'm happy. I like what your doing with the article on comp, keep it up. Its good for comp to get some exposure. You are welcome to stop by if you have any questions in the future about what happened or why we are doing what we are. We need all the help we can get to let people know what comp is all about
 
Thanks for replies guys. I guess based on the length of time I have been around drag racing I realize I could not run comp. It would be too hard to lift, when you know you can win a race.



I have similar talks to some of the top bracket racers as well, and their fender racing is what gets them the money, racing like you do is not their game.

But with some of these bracket racers they sandbag 2-6 hun most of the time, but it did cost a few last weekend. when they hold and the track or the air improves (more than they anticipated) they went under by a bunch, I bugged them because they were holding to much, they said they ran quicker then they though. I saiid if you dial harder (maybe 1 or 2 hun) and the track and air improves when you dump you should be safe,

I hope all you fast guys (more than -.6-.8 guys) do find it in your plan to win one or two at least, cause the dumping for us fans and journalists kind of burns us off.
Why was your speed down so much Rob, were you dumping all the time even in qualifying. Your car should be 175 or so with a low 60 pass.

Dean
 
Not to further complicate the issue (but this will) Dean , we were trying to qualify 4 , but we ran our best incrementals ever , so that screwed our calculation's up on where to lift , not by much .02 , but nonetheless , we blew it. In all honesty , it seldom does work out , when you try and play ladder games , but we all try it. If it had been a 17 car field , EVERYONE would of been flat out to get that #1 spot , bye 1st round and a bye to the final.

Reflecting on your disgust (for lack of a better word) with this dumping , as you put it , (we were down 25 mph on most runs) I totally get what you are saying , it is fundamentally wrong . The problem with Comp is the cost of a permanent index hit , no one can afford it , so lifting is a big part of how you race , and the CIC is the way they try and level the playing field , so you got a tenth to use , to win , without a Monday morning funeral.

Brandon decided to run his car out in qualifying (as he said) he likes to run fast and to hell with the ladder games , everyone should of done the same , it would of at least reduced the lack of RACING and or the reason a team races , to try and qualify #1 AND just go fast. Instead we offered up some non sensical game ,that only happens in Comp and gives us all a bad name . For the few times the ladder game works out , we should all abandon it and give the fans a true showing of Comp cars running flat out......at least in qualifying.....it's not much to ask.
 
We all need to look for a series sponsor that could put up a low qualifyer bonus. It would need to be big enough (say $500) to make people want to shoot for it. Mabie even split it up between the top three to give more a shot at it? I think this would help improve things,more guys running thier car flat out in qualifying. $500 X 6 races = $3000. We should be able to raise that? Alot of us are business owners and mabie we could all kick in a little? We each put $200 in the pot at the beginning of the year......

Over the years I have seen nothing that makes a racer do things different then MONEY... lol....

I bet Frank Nelson Jr would be all for it,he likes comp and wants to see it get better.
 
"The thing is... 1st if my main goal was to win Mission I would have been shutting off in qualifying and qualifying a little lower. I love running my car and trying new things and learning more. 2nd.... I am not the only C/A car in the country. I am freinds with some of these guys, not all... but some, I feel in good condition's I should try to be resposible, its not all about me and its not good for the class to ruin C/A. Its second round at a point meet, who cares! I went a 23 at 188 in 1800 foot of air, I'm happy."


smart comp racer right there

ian
 
Great idea , Mark , money over points , kind of like the Mission National Open , no points , just good old fashioned cash and more of it to win than a points-race , go figure. And Terry , you can set the 1/8th mile record too....
 
Rob Harrison said:
Great idea , Mark , money over points , kind of like the Mission National Open , no points , just good old fashioned cash and more of it to win than a points-race , go figure. And Terry , you can set the 1/8th mile record too....
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Rob, I ran the 1/8th mile record last year at this event but wasn't prepared to pull it apart..lol...I'm waiting to here back from Div. 6 on the acquisition of a big pump...and would love to see div. 7 get one for Vegas...I just don't want to pull her apart again as I'm not getting any younger and too exhausted....but maybe I would change my mind if I see a 6.49'sh pass...lol
 
I absolutely would be in for helping out the class money wise, but would be more interested in doing it for elminations ......Ya I know, you racers won't change your eliminations way of racing unless it was rreeaallllyy worth it.


dean
 
Rob Harrison said:
We are so hard to change , Dean , I wish common sense was the way....
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My race partner Dick Mauceri and have talked about this.... and this is what he had to say...

Actually, when you think about it this is another example of the best intentions gone awry! The whole system of a class index to run against (like comp), but being allowed to run faster SHOULD end the dumping on the top end. Then, to keep the index current, create a "window" that if you stay within (like it is now) the index remains the same. If you are faster than the "window" then the index gets adjusted to get it back to the "window". In theory, everybody runs all out and over time the indexes get adjusted so that the top guys in all classes are in the same "window". Result, all out racing, close competition. And if all the fastest guys did this it would probably work.

But the law of unintended consequences always is in play! If you are a fast guy who can run out of the "window" you see that as an advantage you have. So, you try to avoid going too fast in order to keep your advantage. But by doing so, you often give up your advantage.

Its nuts, but its human nature.
 
Bring back index hits in qualifying AND give us a pro ladder. It would be like the wild west in the comp pits. One year is all it would take to see finish line racing.
 
You sort of got it , but the advantage is only an advantage if you use it , if you use it , the system takes it away , your reward for going too fast. If you take the limit away , and run off a zero index system , then all the fast cars win , not a good situation for participation in Comp.

The CIC system is the best way to even the playing field , the fast cars will continue to protect that almighty index , win or lose , just ask Rampy or Fletcher or ....nature of the beast , damned if you do , damned if you don't.
 
We often sit around the shop here and try to come up with the right way to deal with all of the senerio that effects our class... This could be a long shot, but what about looking at the 1/8 mile times in qualifying and eliminations to be the decision on index adjustment? Take All runs in all classes, and at the end of the year, if there is an index that is (soft) or in need of adjustment, NHRA does so... Of course we would need Patrick Hale to help out on the 1/8 to correct 1/4 mile times... Just a thought, I also like the idea of a pro ladder!

Chad Perkin
6869 E/A
 
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