pro ladder vs sportsman ladder

Since its starting to snow here and we're supposed to get like 20" I figured I would get a little debate going. to warm me up haha Anyone on here want to see Comp switch to a pro ladder? Pros and cons to it? It would help with all the sandbagging, hanging out in the staging lanes after a 3rd and final call to the lanes so someone can try and pick their spot (you know who you are) shutting off early and see more runs to the finish line during qualifying trying to get a spot towards the top of the ladder.

 

Comp WFO Qualifying!!!
Let's have it in every division and at the nationals.
You're racing from the time you get there until you leave.
It works in Div 4.
The program addresses all of your issue's.

 

I do love me some WFO qualifying! But, would you like to see eliminations switch to a pro ladder where 1 would race 32, 2 races 31 16 races 17?

 

This has been discussed in the past. A big reason why the pro ladder doesn't really work for the class as a whole is what it does to CIC in early rounds. For example #1 is -65 and runs #32 -45. Assuming nothing wacky, #1 can probably get by with a -50 pass (No cic penalty). But now 16&17 are both -55 cars and it takes a -55 run for #17 to win (.05 cic penalty). Fast forward to E2 and now #17 is .05 farther away from #1 than he would've been if they just raced first round like the sportsman ladder is.

From a fast car's perspective, sure, it's an advantage. But for everyone else it's a negative.

 

Pro class, pro ladder

sportsman class, sportsman’s ladder

fair enough??

 

Im ok with the sportsman ladder. It does make it harder for the highest qualifiers, and more likely that soft indexes will take CIC hits. And thats not a bad thing.

 

1. I hate snow or cold for that matter
2. I hate people waiting to the last to go up and run a qualifying run. I like to go first that way I can be number one qualifier for Atleast a little while.
Clark Smiley

 

I had a couple people in Division 2 and a couple in d6 ask me that’s why I brought this up….. fair enough?

 

You would really hate it up here right now then

 

All’s fair in love and war. We did try this some time back can’t remember when maybe early 2000’s didn’t rewrite any history as far as I can remember but I can’t remember shit anyways anymore

 

Alan is right.. I remember it was tried one time, some where, BUT it was apparently as unimpressive as using a Pro tree in Comp.. and Matt is also right in saying that the middle of the pack cars actually get penalized with a Pro ladder.. those at the bottom of the qualifying sheet can pray for an opponent's redlight in first round, or not leave the trailer for first round..

We've recently seen a large spread between the top spot and the bottom spot.. with a Pro ladder, the faster car could actually have a 3 to 4 tenths cushion.. doesn't sound like fair racing to me.. just sayin'..

 

So you are telling me the fast car shouldn’t get an advantage. Sounds wrong to me.
You are saying it should be fair. I guess everyone should get a participation trophy.
The slow car already gets his own index that should be help enough.
Clark Smiley

 

Wow, we agree on something. I believe Comp has become a glorified bracket race, except in division 4 qualifying.

 

When we were the slow car and getting bounced in the 1st round for 20 years everyone always said for us to “work on our shit”
When youre a fast car everyone wants you to fuck your index up so you become slow again haha
You busted your butt to qualify in the top half of the field why shouldn’t you possibly get a decent first round match up?

 

Amazing how that works, isn"t it. I have a racer friend that says "it is their sandbox (nhra comp rules) and if you do not like the rules, do not play" Wonder how many do not play when they see all the comp rules? And wasn't there some controversy with the Bonus fund at the end of last year, Sandbagging, blocking?

 

UMMMMMM.. let's see now.. with a Sportsman ladder, #1 runs #17.. this means that #1 was far more under the index than #17, which becomes an advantage for the #1 car.. with a Pro ladder, #1 will run #32, and probably with a double advantage for the #1 car, depending on how far each car is under the index.. doesn't that sound like advantages to you??...

Comp is not like Pro Stock, where .05 could be the difference between #1 and #16.. in Comp, you could be talking tenths between the top qualifier, and the guy at the bottom of the list.. you could always try to ask NHRA for a 16 car qualified field, instead of 32, and then try your Pro ladder, BUT, the results would be the same, unless everyone is a -60+ player.. that's a rare find in qualifying these days..

I'm not saying that the fastest qualifier should not have an advantage, because in reality, they do.. that's what all the hard work and money spent is all about.. my point is to not make it worse on the slower cars at the bottom of the ladder.. it gets expensive for those racers to enter races, only to chalk the races up as expensive test sessions.. a couple of qualifying passes, use 1st round as another test run, and go home.. believe me, I did it for several years driving an A/EA, that at -40 to -45 was never better than the 22 spot, back in the day..

 

Just looking real quick at Belle rose. The top qualified guys only had about a tenth on their opponent first round. And the guys on the bottom of the top half of the feild had about half a second on their opponents. Seems like they are lucky as fuck. Or good at positioning their qualifying efforts. So the top guys are likely down going into second round and the middle pack guys are clean. Seems kinda non advantageous to be a badass and go to the top.
Clark Smiley

 

Better make sure all the sportsman classes run on a non “pro” tree. That way it is fair!!